alt.hn

3/30/2026 at 11:59:53 AM

Set the Line Before It's Crossed

 https://nomagicpill.substack.com/p/set-the-line-before-its-crossed

by surprisetalk

4/2/2026 at 3:01:05 AM

This is missing the most important step: get out there and practice.

You're not going to succeed at steps #6 and #7 in situations as dire as what the author describes without practicing a bunch. You have to choose low stakes, real situations to gain experience:

* a cashier asks you if you want to round up by donating to charity

* a friend asks if you want to do an activity with them, and you do not want to do that activity with them

* someone suggests splitting the check down the middle, but you only had a tiny side salad

* etc.

You can of course handle these however you want. But if you want to learn to set a line when it's important, you should have already practiced in a dozen or so cases like this, without apologizing: No, thank you / No, I'm not into that / I'm leaving enough to pay for my tiny side salad plus a nice tip

Practice doesn't guarantee you won't buckle in tough situations. But you'll definitely buckle if you don't.

by jancsika

4/2/2026 at 12:50:41 AM

I'm not convinced setting clear lines is a net positive. A line means digging your heels in. The act of setting a line makes you resistant to change: you anchor your values as they are today, and it comes at the cost of tomorrow.

Domestic violence is an obvious line to set, but are you really going to cut a good friend off for not repaying a loan? I would argue that the former is a net good (protects people from abuse) while the latter is a net harm (causes people to abandon their friends when times are bad, without helping to get repaid). I would also argue that most lines fall into the latter category.

Setting lines to protect moral, philosophical, or political beliefs seems even worse, because it's preventing you from changing your mind about those things. Once you've set a line, you can't adapt to change as easily. Having criteria for changing your mind is a band-aid over the problem, because those criteria are set by you as you are today, and they're biased by your current beliefs.

by strken

4/2/2026 at 4:34:15 AM

"setting a line" really means having solid principles to deal with situations. it doesn't mean you have to be rigid, but it does mean you have to proactively think about what you want and what is acceptable, so you have something to fall back on when situations get complex

I think this article is a pretty good complement to ask vs. guess culture https://jeanhsu.substack.com/p/ask-vs-guess-culture

in my experience, people from ask-heavy cultures will only respond to clear lines. otherwise they will just keep pushing. if you have people in your life who are very good at recognizing soft boundaries, you don't need this skill with them, but it will be helpful for people who ignore soft boundaries.

by 121789

4/2/2026 at 7:11:55 AM

> are you really going to cut a good friend off for not repaying a loan?

In my experience nobody asks me, their friend, for a (nontrivial) loan unless they've exhausted more conventional lines of credit. Bank loans, credit cards, getting their parents to bail them out.

The friends who I'd rely on to pay their debts don't need $500 from me to help cover their rent this month. And the friends who are already struggling with credit card debt ain't good credit risks, and don't need more debt added to the pile.

I'd sooner just gift them the $500 in the first place.

by michaelt

4/2/2026 at 7:29:02 AM

I just loaned a friend $1k for rent and I have no idea whether he'll ever pay it back. I agree that it's healthier to think about it as a gift that may or may not make its way back.

Not being repaid is possibly a reason not to lend him any more money. I don't see it as a reason to cut contact with him, though.

by strken

4/2/2026 at 7:34:37 AM

It's about framing, really. Alice and Bob go into a building. They walk out of the building, but Alice is $500 richer. What happened in the building? We have zero idea. We can project all sorts of assumptions as to how Alice walked out of there $500 richer, but based on the information given, you'd be inventing details as to why.

Thus, if you read this comment, you owe me $5, payable via nothing, because money is a construct anyway. So if you can afford to, give your friend a monetary gift. If they can't repay you, and you can't afford to not have that money, then you can't afford to lend them that money and you have to learn to say no.

by fragmede

4/2/2026 at 3:26:10 AM

I agree, and the point I challenge is the blog post's first:

> Lines Will Move Further Away If They Aren’t Defined

Is that necessarily a bad thing?

Sometimes I think some line is important, then I move closer to it, and realise the line is less important to me, and so I'll be less cautious of it.

Some might say "slippery slope!" or "boiling a frog!", but I think of it as me updating my values as I learn more.

Some people are prone to black-and-white thinking, and so I can see why they might be drawn to hard lines.

by farfatched

4/2/2026 at 1:03:01 AM

Most people don't treat their line setting as holy scripture. Besides, nobody stops you from putting your actions on a sliding scale.

Did your good friend not repay his loan? Okay, what's the size of the loan, and how did they react when you reminded them? What's the circumstances surrounding the loan itself - did they borrow for the down payment of a mansion, or did they borrow to buy cheese?

Also, if you're treating your life as a game theory set piece then perhaps that's a place where you should start making changes. Just sayin'.

by my_throwaway23

4/2/2026 at 1:10:42 AM

[dead]

by cindyllm

4/2/2026 at 4:09:28 AM

Setting lines (or 'boundaries' as is the popular word in today's pop psychology) is not something you should do lightly. At the end of the day, a boundary is an ultimatum you're setting on someone else's behavior. Treat it that way. Sometimes ultimatums are necessary. Sometimes they're toxic. Don't be that person with a minefield full of unnecessary boundaries you expect everyone else to dance around and jump through as a condition of interacting with you.

by ryandrake

4/2/2026 at 6:46:10 AM

> a boundary is an ultimatum you're setting on someone else's behavior

No, it's not.

A boundary is something you're saying about your behavior. "If you use racist language at me, I will have to end this conversation."

And much, much worse than someone with "a minefield full of unnecessary boundaries" is someone who has boundaries they don't tell you about.

You should only set boundaries that are real boundaries for you, not just whims or arbitrary decisions. But if you do have boundaries—and everyone does; if you think you don't, then you just haven't had someone cross them (or haven't realized that's what happened when they did)—you must communicate them in contexts where there's a real chance of them being crossed.

To do otherwise is unfair to everyone else and to yourself.

by danaris

4/2/2026 at 7:48:33 AM

I'm not sure how that example differs from an ultimatum.

by strken

4/2/2026 at 8:57:59 AM

To me, the difference is positive vs negative acts.

An ultimatum says “you must do X or else I will do Y”

A boundary says “you must refrain from X or else I will do Y”.

by danielheath

4/2/2026 at 2:08:38 AM

>Domestic violence is an obvious line to set

is it? the example given for things implied to disallow are playful pinching/punching.

Even the author's implied choice of line is suspect here.

by knollimar

4/2/2026 at 4:02:28 AM

If you think someone might be a DV risk that seems like a reasonable line as long as your expectations are clear.

by recursive

4/2/2026 at 2:51:16 AM

What is "playful punching"?

by malfist

4/2/2026 at 3:16:51 AM

I'll know it when I see it

by maest

4/2/2026 at 2:01:48 AM

Here's a remark I made about setting boundaries in a completely different forum:

More from the pasture: The herd has settled. The chestnut mare is boss, and she's a good alpha. My paint mare is second. The old draft horse gelding is third, and the grey is fourth. Today I went into the pasture to catch the paint. I call her, and she comes to me. But chestnut boss comes up and herds the paint away from me. So I have to have a talk with the boss.

I make eye contact with her, and walk up to her. She glares at me, but doesn't show hostility. I wave my hands a little at waist level, and she backs up one step. That's a mild submission, and all I needed. Now I can halter the paint mare. The boss mare watches closely, but does not interfere.

As someone else says, handling horses will teach you about setting boundaries in a very practical way.

by Animats

4/2/2026 at 12:25:57 AM

It’s ok, Harlan, you save up for that baby and don’t let the cult browbeat you over it.

(People are fuzzy and while game theory is fun and even sometimes useful, this kind of stuff skeeves me out and I think it lures “smart” people in and gets them to empower the SBFs of the world. My altruism is ineffective and I’m happy that way.)

by _dwt

4/2/2026 at 4:28:52 AM

> Automate the action. For example, write a script that looks to see if the friend who borrowed money ever paid it back by a certain date. If current_date > deadline_date & money_repaid = false, then send an automated email unfriending them.

email contents: Hey, btw im not ur friend anymore. regards, not your friend

by sidrag22

4/2/2026 at 1:37:41 AM

Overly general vibeslopped platitudes.

by rdevilla

4/2/2026 at 6:06:48 AM

When is taking an action not associated with a line? What if you just enjoy taking action?

by skyberrys

4/2/2026 at 2:47:38 AM

When abuse done to parents by their child. When parents keep denying lines have been crossed. They live in delusional state everything good, wait for one more day and it will stop. But it keeps aggravating till everything fall aparts, other members of family affected. When one child goes wrongway and parents are reluctant to accept it they kept clinging to them, they never settle upon line's crossed now it should stop as they can't hurt their child, they can't give up on them, ultimately that child starts feeling invincible whatever they may do they won't be stopped or punished by parents, and eventually parents unknowingly destroying life of their other child, other members of family, for their love of one bad element that they can't give up. Thats my personal experience, having my life destroyed, good happy smiling family teared apart, because one of sibling gone wrong way started abusing our parents, and they did'nt drew lines, kept forgiving.

by G_o_D

4/2/2026 at 2:31:04 AM

I wish I had learned to do this years ago. I still do not know how to do this now.

by plagiarist

4/2/2026 at 6:54:49 AM

My line is: No advice from llms. This seems to be one. Sigh.

by kappuchino

4/2/2026 at 4:00:05 AM

so glad that slippery slopes returned to the overton window. What a relief.

by tonymet

4/2/2026 at 12:57:38 AM

This is neat in theory, but unworkable in practice.

The hard line trigger almost always happens in a wider context. You often want the wider context, but it's impossible to fully define. Let's try a few examples from the article:

"Hard line: Annual raise is 0%" -> What if it comes with a much larger stock grant? Or additional paid time off? Or something else you value? Will you really just mechanistically quit?

"Hard line: A friend doesn’t repay an $X loan" -> really? What if, say, they lost their job? You want to make friendship contingent on your friends employed. There's a reason there's an adage saying "Don't loan money to a friend, you might need to decide whom you like more".

"Hard line: A government blatantly violates a constitutional amendment" -> Not even waiting for a court decision? What if it's Abraham Lincoln suspending Habeas Corpus? Or Wilson enforcing the espionage act, if that's more your political leaning? What if the government first repeals the amendment - will you be pro-slavery if it's made legal?

The world isn't a series of if-then statements. Even a hard line requires more than a single condition - at best, that condition reminds you to re-evaluate where you are.

by groby_b

4/2/2026 at 1:14:15 AM

> "Hard line: Annual raise is 0%" -> What if it comes with a much larger stock grant? Or additional paid time off? Or something else you value? Will you really just mechanistically quit?

I don't want to be a pedant but more stock or time off are raises by another name. They're literally money the company gives you.

by triceratops

4/2/2026 at 1:48:30 AM

This article crosses a line for me.

The line is “It’s not necessarily helpful to be clear about lines.” combined with “who the hell are you to tell us how to live, kiddo?” with a little bit of “let’s all silently agree that each human should be defensive and prickly at all times instead of ever being soft and accommodating to their friends and family and colleagues.”

Some will downvote this comment just because I am being trying to be clear about my lines right now, which proves my point. If popularity matters to me, I need to do more smiling and shrugging.

by satisfice

4/2/2026 at 8:07:05 AM

The article is slop. No human ever talks about domestic abuse or heart attacks like that

by throwaway290

4/2/2026 at 4:37:43 AM

[dead]

by stephbook

4/2/2026 at 12:45:00 AM

[dead]

by my_throwaway23

4/2/2026 at 2:29:20 AM

Boundaries are a privilege available only to those able to deal with the consequences of enforcing them.

by acuozzo

4/2/2026 at 2:33:51 AM

Not having boundaries is the privilege of those with resources to replace what is lost through actions of their transgressors

by awakeasleep