alt.hn

2/1/2026 at 6:52:25 PM

Once Thought to Support Neurons, Astrocytes Turn Out to Be in Charge

https://www.quantamagazine.org/once-thought-to-support-neurons-astrocytes-turn-out-to-be-in-charge-20260130/

by ibobev

2/1/2026 at 11:02:16 PM

Always a good bet in biology that the thing we think is "junk" or "passive" or "dumb" is doing much more, we just don't understand it yet.

the experiment on "giving up" is pretty cool:

>All the while, the researchers monitored neurons and astrocytes in the zebra fish’s brain using advanced whole-brain imaging techniques. As the fish fruitlessly fought the current, neurons that release norepinephrine fired; in response, calcium built up in astrocytes. The buildup paralleled the number of attempts the fish made to fight the current, as if the astrocytes were keeping track — until at some point they issued a stop signal, and the zebra fish gave up. When Ahrens’ team disabled the astrocytes using a laser, the fish never stopped swimming. And if the astrocytes were artificially activated, the fish stopped right away.

by marojejian

2/3/2026 at 11:51:50 PM

Not an expert in neurobiology, but... heck this is Hacker News:

Let's assume that the brain implements a renormalization group flow in a way similar to transformers, as described here: https://arxiv.org/abs/2507.17912

In biological neural networks, synaptic weight distributions presumably have some effective α. Learning perturbs α away from optimal — overfitting would correspond to α drifting toward values that capture training noise rather than generalizable structure. The question becomes: what mechanism pushes α back toward 2?

Astrocytes are positioned to do exactly this. They don't modify individual synaptic weights (that's Hebbian learning), but they modulate the gain of synaptic transmission across vast swaths of tissue simultaneously. This is a different kind of operation — more like rescaling the entire weight matrix or reshaping its spectral density than updating individual entries.

Consider what happens during sleep. The synaptic homeostasis hypothesis (Tononi & Cirelli) proposes that sleep globally downscales synaptic strengths, renormalizing the system after a day of potentiation. This is literally a renormalization operation — a rescaling that preserves relative structure while adjusting the overall scale. If astrocytes mediate this process (and the Quanta article suggests they track sleep debt via calcium accumulation), they might be implementing something like the ERG step that SETOL identifies as optimal.

The scale-invariance condition is key. SETOL states that the ideal layer is governed by a Scale-Invariant transformation equivalent to a single step of an Exact Renormalization Group transformation. Astrocytes, by modulating transmission globally rather than synapse-by-synapse, naturally implement transformations that preserve relative structure while adjusting scale — exactly the kind of operation that could maintain or restore scale invariance.

The zebrafish "giving up" experiment becomes interesting through this lens. When the fish swims futilely, neural circuits are active in a regime that's metabolically expensive but informationally unproductive — the current model (swimming should work) is wrong, and the system is far from any useful attractor. The accumulated evidence in astrocytes might track not just "futility" in behavioral terms but deviation from optimal α — a signature that the current operating regime violates the ERG condition.

The state switch, then, isn't just behavioral resignation. It's the system recognizing that its current configuration is far from scale-invariant equilibrium and forcing a transition to a different basin where better spectral properties can be achieved. The adenosine release that triggers the switch would be the biological mechanism implementing what mathematically amounts to a large step in parameter space toward a more ERG-compliant regime.

The deepest connection might be to criticality itself. Systems at critical points exhibit scale invariance — correlations extend across all scales, and the system looks statistically similar under coarse-graining. The α = 2 condition in SETOL might be a signature of criticality in the weight space, just as power-law correlations are signatures of criticality in physical systems.

If brains operate near criticality, maintaining that critical state requires feedback — something must detect drift toward subcritical or supercritical regimes and push back. Astrocytes, with their slow timescales and broad spatial integration, are ideally positioned to monitor deviations from criticality and implement corrective homeostasis.

The Kadanoff-Wilson RG originated in the theory of phase transitions. SETOL adapts it to neural networks. The biological realization might be: neurons implement fast inference (the "flow" of representations through layers), while astrocytes implement slow RG steps that maintain the spectral conditions (α ≈ 2) under which that inference remains optimal.

Testable Predictions This framework suggests several predictions: * Synaptic weight distributions should drift away from α = 2 during extended waking and return toward it during sleep. * Astrocyte-deficient or astrocyte-disrupted animals should show abnormal weight spectral properties — perhaps more variance in α across brain regions, or systematic drift away from optimal values. * The giving-up threshold might correlate with cumulative deviation of local circuit α from 2 — not just behavioral futility, but a kind of "spectral stress" that astrocytes track. * Interventions that artificially maintain α ≈ 2 (if such were possible) might reduce the need for sleep or astrocytic modulation.

Any experts here? Astrocytes as implementers of biological RG steps that maintain the spectral conditions for optimal inference?

by riemannzeta

2/2/2026 at 7:07:19 AM

“ New experiments reveal how astrocytes tune neuronal activity to modulate our mental and emotional states”

But it’s already known that they modulate neuronal synaptic activity, this is not new?

by moi2388

2/2/2026 at 5:02:50 PM

Maybe it's in the details? The article reads as if it was longer known that astrocytes somehow modulate neurons, but not the mechanism behind it, not what exactly there is modulated and on which stimuli.

I imagine it's the difference between knowing that a layer inside an ANN "processes information" and knowing the specific semantics that this layer represents.

by xg15

2/2/2026 at 4:57:55 PM

Researchers also know that astrocytes are active participants in computation for some areas that have been studied (vision and also memory).

The article seems about 5 to 10 years late.

by RaftPeople