4/26/2025 at 4:48:09 AM
The US is falling way behind in electric vehicles. If BYD could sell in the US, the US auto industry would be crushed.[1]What went wrong is that 1) Tesla never made a low-end vehicle, despite announcements, and 2) all the other US manufacturers treated electric as a premium product, resulting in the overpowered electric Hummer 2 and F-150 pickups with high price tags. The only US electric vehicle with comparable prices in electric and gasoline versions is the Ford Transit.
BYD says that their strategy for now is to dominate in every country that does not have its own auto industry. Worry about the left-behind countries later.
BYD did it by 1) getting lithium-iron batteries to be cheaper, safer, and faster-charging, although heavier than lithium-ion, 2) integrating rear wheels, differential, axle, and motor into an "e-axle" unit that's the entire mechanical part of the power train, and 3) building really big auto plants in China.
Next step is to get solid state batteries into volume production, and build a new factory bigger than San Francisco.
by Animats
4/26/2025 at 7:10:17 AM
I think one of the biggest problems in the United States is the misallocation of ambitious people. The highly educated and ambitious people see finance, government, tech, and corporate executive tracks, as the way to convert their energies into social status.Even startups these days seem to be a case of too many chiefs, not enough Indians.
by IceHegel
4/26/2025 at 7:53:16 AM
When Elon gets excited about displacing his engineers on a whim with H1Bs, why would any highly educated ambitious person want to work for Tesla?by jmpman
4/26/2025 at 8:41:23 AM
And the worst thing is that Elon could've been a living legend by building/funding colleges and schools focused on the tech his companies need, software development, robotics etc. Or even given out million dollar scholarships for the very top students.And he still would've been worth over 250 billion easily.
Instead he chose to buy the president and start "optimising" the government with AI.
by theshrike79
4/26/2025 at 9:09:10 AM
> And the worst thing is that Elon could've been a living legend by building/funding colleges and schools focused on the tech his companies need, software development, robotics etc.Could he, though?
I mean, he might have the cash, but if you look at his history you don't see that much interest or respect for basic academic principles, or even any basic academic achievement whatsoever.
He conveys an image of someone who is mentally trapped in prepubescence, and who repeatedly does things that a prepubescent kid does to try to gather admiration. I meant who desperately tries to pass themselves off as elite gamers? How long will it take until he moves on to DJing? That's not someone who has any interest in founding education institutions.
The man does have an army of terminally online sycophants, which I now wonder whether they are astroturfed.
by motorest
4/26/2025 at 9:34:12 AM
I think the point is he could if he was a different person.by e40
4/26/2025 at 10:18:27 AM
> I think the point is he could if he was a different person.That statement is pointless. The critical factor is not money, it's willingness. You do not even need to be the world's richest man to put together a school. There are pro athletes with a fraction of the wealth that already do meaningful investments in education.
by motorest
4/26/2025 at 10:31:56 AM
He has two degrees. BA in Physics and BSc in Economicsby voidspark
4/26/2025 at 11:07:13 AM
> He has two degrees. BA in Physics and BSc in EconomicsYou should verify your claims
https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/musk-physics-degree/
From the article:
> Musk's past statements about his educational background, however, have been, at best, imprecise. He has claimed on several occasions to have received a physics degree in 1995 — a claim that was never fully true but which may have aided Musk's early business career.
by motorest
4/26/2025 at 11:40:16 AM
The Snopes article confirms the comment you're replying to. The sentence you left out, before your quote:> The University of Pennsylvania considers Musk to be a graduate of both the economics department and the physics department.
And right above that, from the University of Pennsylvania:
> Elon Musk earned a B.A. in physics and a B.S. in economics (concentrations: finance and entrepreneurial management) from the University of Pennsylvania. The degrees were awarded on May 19, 1997.
by rascul
4/26/2025 at 1:28:44 PM
>Does Elon Musk Have an Undergraduate Degree in Physics?>Rating: True
>Musk has on previous occasions claimed he received this degree in 1995, but the University of Pennsylvania says it was awarded in 1997.
What was the point of your comment?
by weberer
4/26/2025 at 11:39:11 AM
Elon has proven to truly be the dumbest smart guy ever. He alienated Tesla’s core customers; tree hugging liberals, and anyone who cares about sustainability. The GOP nor their voters care and never will. I called this Tesla stock crash months ago; did not act on it though.by le-mark
4/26/2025 at 2:23:33 PM
I think less people care about it politically than you think. Most people I know who have Teslas stand by the product even through Elon’s dumb shit.I think people care more about their own convenience. There’s nothing else in our market that’s even comparable. People talk a lot of shit and it wasn’t great to start but FSD is on a different level now, especially on newer cars like the new Model Y. Having a car that mostly drives itself is the best purchase I’ve ever made.
It doesn’t seem to be slowing down sales in Seattle. New Model Ys are everywhere here.
by skellera
4/26/2025 at 3:12:13 PM
Tesla once again tells its own CEO Elon Musk to knock it off with the politics - https://electrek.co/2025/04/22/tesla-once-again-tells-ceo-el... - April 22nd, 202567% of Americans would not consider buying a Tesla, new poll says - https://electrek.co/2025/03/28/most-americans-would-not-cons... - March 28th, 2025
Tesla sales fall by 49% in Europe even as the electric vehicle market grows - https://apnews.com/article/tesla-sales-recall-trump-byd-b6f5... - March 25, 2025
Tesla is done in Germany: 94% say they won’t buy a Tesla car - https://electrek.co/2025/03/14/tesla-is-done-in-germany-94-s... - March 14th, 2025
Australian Tesla sales plummet as owners rush to distance themselves from Elon Musk -https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2025/mar/06/australia... - March 6th, 2025
(own several Teslas, won't buy another)
by toomuchtodo
4/26/2025 at 2:54:28 PM
This anecdote doesn’t match the data.It is definitely slowing demand. You can see it in the Q1 numbers and the discounts on vehicles.
You can ask anyone who buys used EVs in Seattle. There is a glut of Tesla sellers and not many buyers.
Like it or not, your car says a lot about you. People bought Teslas because they liked what they said and now they are avoiding them because they don’t like it.
by gdudeman
4/26/2025 at 12:22:38 PM
One interesting thing is that he seems completely unaware that he is the problem. Stepping back from DOGE to focus on Tesla again. He thinks that him getting closer to Tesla will help save the brand, when it's exactly his association with it that caused the damage in the first place.The best thing he could do for Tesla would be to step aside.
> I called this Tesla stock crash months ago
TSLA is currently up 5% MoM despite really, really horrible earnings and outlook. The market can stay irrational longer than you can stay solvent sometimes.
by rco8786
4/26/2025 at 12:33:10 PM
I don't think stock prices matter as much to him (everybody knows there are lots of expectations baked in the price).by klntsky
4/26/2025 at 1:26:21 PM
Nor do I, I'm sure he's aware it's propped up on nothing but fumes and vibes. I was just commenting on OP wishing they had shorted TSLA months ago. Easy to say in hindsight, is all.by rco8786
4/26/2025 at 8:42:41 AM
> (...) why would any highly educated ambitious person want to work for Tesla?To that dimension I would add ethics as well. It's very hard to justify working for the likes of Tesla when being mindful of the attitude the company and company representatives have with regards to basic issues ranging from workers rights to totalitarianism.
by motorest
4/26/2025 at 8:51:05 AM
I mean, that's one way to get Indians!by zem
4/26/2025 at 9:45:55 AM
Well the problem is US wants to be the world's managers. And all we cared about is writing messenger apps. Totally missed the boat on building things, like houses, boats, and most of all new weird things we don't even have a concept for.by almosthere
4/26/2025 at 10:23:55 AM
Watching nearly the entire software-financial complex burn to the ground when the vaunted "moats" dry up is going to be a hell of a sight. All this AI hype is just going to end up commodifying the very thing that the entire industry is built on: management of processes.Places that understand that physical production cannot be abstracted forever will prevail.
by grues-dinner
4/26/2025 at 11:31:07 AM
> Well the problem is US wants to be the world's managers.I think the problem is more nuanced than that. The US was effectively "the world's managers", in the sense that their economic might, entrepreneur culture, and push for globalization resulted in a corporate structure where the ownership and executive levels were US whereas non-critical business domains reflected the local workforce, whether it was the US or not.
This setup worked great while the US dominated the world's economy and influenced their allies and trading partners to actively engage in globalization.
Now that Trump is pushing for isolationism, of course things change.
by motorest
4/26/2025 at 10:34:04 AM
Andrew Yang launched a presidential campaign based on this idea, he wrote a book:“Smart People Should Build Things”
by Jorge1o1
4/26/2025 at 12:21:02 PM
Can you demonstrate that this misallocation is worse in the US than it is in other countries?by rco8786
4/26/2025 at 10:32:24 AM
- "BYD did it by"Also the many systemic, industry-wide factors discussed last week in
https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=43692677 ("America underestimates the difficulty of bringing manufacturing back (molsonhart.com)" — 1010 comments)
I agree with the gist of that piece; focusing on specific engineering choices (important as they are) is missing the forest for a particularly interesting tree. Any American EV maker is heavily disadvantaged right now, no matter how clever they are.
by perihelions
4/26/2025 at 12:36:14 PM
The US automakers lost the plot a long time ago, and have just been sucking out money without innovation or improvement since.When California and the EPA tried to legislate lower emissions 9 years into the future, the US automakers sued to block saying it was impossible. Japanese automakers were already selling vehicles that met those standards.
When they badly, badly screw up, they just get bailed out with public funds and then go on to pay execs tens of millions of dollars a year and fat bonuses. Guaranteed profits no matter what made them lazy and uncompetitive.
They’re all dying
by testing22321